You and others support the universal healthcare provided for in your country. How many unbelievers do the same? You support Brexit, how many unregenerate do the same?
I am not condemning your support of either of the above. I am just saying that the fact that the unregenerate support the same thing you do doesnâ€™t mean you are compromising the gospel or are diminishing its importance
John I believe QCâ€™s point has nothing to do we a religious gathering or preaching the gospel. The sheriff in my town may be an atheist (he is not ) but we both stand together against murder, stealing, and lawlessness.
The March for Life movement does not say it is religious. It is not the Manhattan Declaration which is religious. According to their website,
â€śTogether we gather to celebrate life. We celebrate life from the moment of conception to the moment of natural death, and every moment in between.â€ť
It is not intended as a religious rally. It is making a statement that thousands are against the sanctioned murdering of babies that Roe v Wade â€ślegalizedâ€ś
You wouldnâ€™t call yourself a compromiser if you and a Muslim man stopped an attack on an elderly lady being beaten by a group of teenagers. How many unbelievers joined Wilberforce in promoting the abolition of slavery in the British Empire? Would you have wanted slavery to stand because it meant you were uniting against it with those who were not believers?
Again, no government allowed for redress of grievances with freedom of assembly ( our1st amendment) at the time the Bible was written, so you will find no â€śBiblical warrantâ€ť for such actions because it wasnâ€™t a possibility.
John UK wrote: Bro US, this is exactly the problem I am trying to identify, and not doing such a good job of it. The plain honest truth of the matter, is that when a parent says he is proud of his offspring, he is actually saying he is proud of himself; he is the one who brought this creature into the world; he is the one who brought the child up; he is the one who nurtured the child; he is the one who taught the child; he is the one who chastised the child. "Look at the child I produced!" This is the heart of the matter. But the truth is, that he has brought into the world someone with a heart that is deceitful above all things and desperately wicked, and they go astray from the womb because of their sinful nature. "Ah but look", he says, "I have brought them to Christ and they are now saved and in their right mind!" Well there you have it. Rotten arminianism. The parent is proud because of his skill, and the child is proud because they made a good decision.
Good points John we should give God glory for any good things that come into our lives and not try and take any personal credit.
John UK wrote: If it was normal for parents to have pride in their children or grandchildren, is there no-one in the Bible who said that?
Matthew 3:17. And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.
John, people are people regardless of when or even where they lived. Parental "pride" in their offspring is ubiquitous to all societies and undoubtedly existed from creation forward. (this is not saying that all parental "pride" is good)
I believe sister BMac noted that what we find in Corinthians and other places is the concept of celebration and commendation. In all things we need to be humbly thankful to our God for what He has done and allowed in our lives and in the lives of those whom we love. To quote her again, the negative merit toward oneself is that which the Lord hates. As you have pointed out anything accomplished or done is because of the mercies of the Lord in the lives of us unworthy ones.
Psalm 127:3 Lo, children are an heritage of the LORD: and the fruit of the womb is His reward
3Jn 1:4 I have no greater joy than to hear that my children walk in truth.
Brother John, I agree with what you have posted. We all need to realize that although we are commanded to work out our salvation with fear and trembling, it is God that works in us both to will and to do of His good pleasure. Though we labor, it is not us but the grace of God working through us fior we are what we are by the grace of God.
Yet we find Paul boasting and praising his spiritual children (I Corinthians 4:15) not only in the previous verses cited about the Corinthians, but also Romans 1:8; Ephesians 1:15; Colossians 1:4; I Thessalonians 1:2,3. Even in heaven our Lord says to those who have faithfully labored for Him, Well done thou good and faithful servant .
To repeat, because you might not be able to go back, my previous post
I believe that we as Christians should humbly thank God for every blessing and mercy He sends our way as we are not deserving of the least of His favor. 1Corinthians . 4:7 For who maketh thee to differ from another? and what hast thou that thou didst not receive? now if thou didst receive it, why dost thou glory, as if thou hadst not received it?
Let him that glories, glory in the Lord for He alone is worthy.
Thank you very much for your post and the great points it makes.
If you look at thread, there was a debate about how pride was defined or used. Brother Lurker had made the comment that he was proud of his children and grandchildren as a proper Scriptural response. Sister BMac asserted that was inappropriate in her comment in which she said â€śThe idea of being proud of something comes not from the Bible but rest on atheistic humanismâ€ť which she amended to note that Paul was celebrating or commending which was Lurkerâ€™s point about being proud of his children and grandchildren. I made no comment about the verses I posted because it was not my desire to have a â€śgotchaâ€ť moment and I addressed her concern about pride in general in my next post after her response. (1/27/2020 9:01Â AM). You will note in that reponse I did not address her negative comment to me in any fashion. (which yes I did address in later posts)
Hindsight says I should have said something with the verses for clarification and I will say that upon consideration of her understanding of it, I offer my apologies for it coming across in a way that was inappropriate and should have done so much earlier.
B. McCausland wrote: Bro. US .... However, interaction characterized by butting against character is not going to be entertained, as in this case, wisdom will advise to postpone personal interaction till we are wholly sanctified.
Sister BMac, I will honor your wish and make this my last interaction with you, Please note of a post I made in this thread (1/26/2020 5:50Â PM)that contained nothing but verses of Scripture you said the following
Yes, unprofitable, true to your true nature you seek to find a gap to butt in to contend ..
Sorry but that goes above my comprehension to say that quoting relevant Scripture fits the description you gave it. I, despite your claim that I was omitting other Scripture, was with you on your posts about pride, which I explained in subsequent post but you seemed to ignore. It seems that whenever I post things contrary to your thinking on a matter you classify it as contentious and/or bullying on my part. I have no beef with you sister and as stated believe your voice is valuable on this forum.
B. McCausland wrote: US Truth crosses the boundries of nationalities. Against truth we measure all situations, America included. Again, true to your past record, smearing character is what one resorts to when you have not a valid argument to bring to the table. Have a good day
If I may take the time to set the record straight
1. I have not and do not resort to character smears here on SermonAudio or anywhere else. Anyone who has posted here for some time will testify to that (not asking that be done)
2. I have not been involved in a discussion of any type with you since 1/27 when you impugned my motive for posting and assigned to me a position that I had not stated, So, to use your words, there was no argument that was fruitlessly trying to be validated.
3. I posted an honest evaluation of your responses to Mike and Joel along with a forthright admonition, and per your opening line truth is our measuring stick.
4. Thank you for the kind wishes for a good day and may you also have a wonderful evening.
Your genuine lack of understanding of the American political system and how our government works coupled with your obvious disdain for it do much to diminish both the quality and credibility of any comment you make on it sister BMac. The election of outspoken socialist Alexandria Ocasio Cortez to Congress over a 10 term incumbent is one of many examples which demonstrate the fallacy of your thinking. You might do well to refrain from trying to come across as a definitive source on subjects where your improper understanding tend to inappropriate conjectures and misguided pontifications
the Bible reminds us in Galatians that as we have opportunity to do good, we should do so to all men, especially those of the household of faith (Galatians 6:10). James 2 reminds us it is futile to just say things when we have the ability to actual help.Â Â That help comes in the form of being active, at least by voting, in the American political system.Â Â That requires being an informed electorate.
Ultimately, yes, our dependence is on the providence of God as He is the one who sets up and/or puts down rulers (Daniel 2:21â€™ Psalm 75:7) and the rulers heart is in Godâ€™s hand (Proverbs 21:1) but we still have our responsibilities to put feet to our prayers in these matters by using the means that God in His providence has given us in our governmental system.
There is a Biblical principle that God is a God of means and if possible we need to put feet, so to speak ,to our prayers.Â Â For instance we look to our Lord for our daily bread, but we work to provide that need,Â Â There is a humble acknowledgment that any ability we have to obtain wealth comes from God (I Chronicles 29:12). Hezekiah trusted God to deliver him from SennacheribÂ Â (II Chronicles 32:8) yet they stopped the waters of fountains outside the city, built up the wall that was broken, raised up towers, repaired Milo, and made darts and shields in abundance (II Chronicles 32:1-7). David proclaimed that God would deliver Goliath into his hand (I Samuel 17:37; 46) bur he made sure he had 5 smooth stones and a sling.
We are commanded to pray for kings and all that are in authority to the end that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty. (I Timothy 2:1-3). In the system of government we enjoy here in the USA we do that through multiple ways including votes, freedom of speech, freedom of assembly, donations and even our court system when those things are abused by those in power.
B. McCausland wrote: Yes, unprofitable, true to your true nature you seek to find a gap to butt in to contend ... The concept of boasting above is about to celebrate, or commend. However, conveniently you have omitted the many verses in scriptures were boasting or its related term, to 'glory', which comes from the same root word, is rendered in the negative as reverting *merit* toward oneself. Seeing you are interested in the topic a word search study would be helpful. "But he that glories, let him glory in the Lord"
BMcCausland, I believe that we as Christians should humbly thank God for every blessing and mercy He sends our way as we are not deserving of the least of His favor.
1Cor. 4:7 For who maketh thee to differ from another? and what hast thou that thou didst not receive? now if thou didst receive it, why dost thou glory, as if thou hadst not received it?
John UK wrote: Quiet Brother, my question would be, "What makes you think that Christians should influence and impact the political system?" What have Christians to do with politics? What I'm looking for is NT examples of such.
Good morning John,
They don't exist because there was no political system in existence at the time of the New Testament that gave the people any power in the political process. Question is moot point. It would be like asking where in the New Testament do we find people carrying the entire Scriptures in their language in something small enough to take with them. We don't say believers today should not do that because there is no New Testament precedent. Such a thing didn't exist at the time
We have to operate under Biblical principles like as you have opportunity do good to all men especially those of the household of faith. That can be done in a representative government that is around today but did not exist at the time of the writing of the New Testament.
B. McCausland wrote: â€¦ and boasting is not recommended as a biblical trait. The idea of being proud of something, comes not from the bible but rests on atheistic humanismâ€¦
2Co 7:14Â Â For if I have boasted any thing to him of you, I am not ashamed; but as we spake all things to you in truth, even so our boasting, which I made before Titus, is found a truth.
2Co 8:24Â Â Wherefore shew ye to them, and before the churches, the proof of your love, and of our boasting on your behalf
2Co 9:2-4Â For I know the forwardness of your mind, for which I boast of you to them of Macedonia, that Achaia was ready a year ago; and your zeal hath provoked very many Yet have I sent the brethren, lest our boasting of you should be in vain in this behalf; that, as I said, ye may be ready:Â Lest haply if they of Macedonia come with me, and find you unprepared, we (that we say not, ye) should be ashamed in this same confident boasting
Thanks for your thoughts James. We also know that everything the Lord spoke to the multitudes was not all parables. (Ie the Sermon on the Mount which included parables but was not all a parable). I believe Paul made a spiritual application of a law that did apply to Oxen. I would term that Biblical principles. To answer your question, no I donâ€™t believe the day of the Lord refers to a 24 hour period. It is like the phrases your day is coming or a day of reckoning. However, I have yet to find an example in Scripture where a thousand didnâ€™t mean a thousand. Appreciate your time and kind responses
Joel I have never met a dispansationalist that believes that all of Revelation is literal. It would be like me saying all Covenant theologians think the whole book is allegorical when they donâ€™t
James both the passage in I Peter and Psalm 90 speak of the fact that a lengthy period of time (1000 years) to us, is minute to our God.Â Â Â The only way to properly get that sense is to let the thousand years represent a thousand years.