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Breaking News Home | All | Religion | Society | Tech | Choice | SA Newsroom
FRONT PAGE  |  8/25/2019
TUESDAY, MAY 14, 2019  |  31 comments
Ex-North Korea military officer once loved regime more than Christ, now he's helping victims escape
As a former North Korean military officer marked for execution, Kim Yong-Hwa says he knows all too well the tribulations facing the thousands of defectors on the run for their lives from the repressive Kim regime of North Korea.

Instead of going to China and shooting himself in a spot where he could only hope his body would not be found, Kim told The Christian Post that he ultimately discovered the truth that the Kim regime kept hidden from North Koreans. From that point, Kim was inspired to live on to tell his story.

Through his journey, Kim discovered the Gospel of Jesus Christ and today runs a South Korean-based ministry that helps other North Korean defectors facing a similar situation in China find their way to safety.

Kim is one of over 32,000 North Korean defectors who has successfully made the treacherous journey through China and other Asian nations to South Korea since the end of ...


CLICK HERE to Read Entire Article
www.christianpost.com

The Gospel of Jesus Christ
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COMMENTS | show all | add new  
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· Page 1 ·  Found: 31 user comment(s)
News Item5/16/19 9:43 PM
Carol | Arizona  Find all comments by Carol
Just listened to that hymn Connor7, and I was tremendously blessed. Thank you for the recommendation to Chris.
31

News Item5/16/19 9:20 PM
Connor7  Find all comments by Connor7
@Chris, I very much enjoy that song, have you heard The Galkin Evangelistic Team play it before? It’s tremendous.
30

News Item5/16/19 8:44 AM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
Chris G P wrote:
I even was asked to choose a hymn for my baptism. (“I heard the voice of Jesus say”).
Chris, that tune does well for Psalm 46, which reads in the Scottish Psalter and begins with....

God is our refuge and our strength,
in straits a present aid;
Therefore, although the earth remove,
we will not be afraid:
Though hills amidst the seas be cast;
Though waters roaring make,
And troubled be; yea though the hills
by swelling seas do shake.

Try it and see, brother.

BTW your difficulty as you related it in your last paragraph will quickly disappear if you focus entirely on the will of God, who also knows that the Psalms came before the crucifixion of his dear Son. Once you begin singing the Psalms by way of obedience rather than rote, the Spirit will open up your mind to even more New Covenant beauties, things you've never seen before, even though you've been many years on pilgrimage.

29

News Item5/16/19 7:04 AM
Chris G P | England  Find all comments by Chris G P
Meanwhile, to return back to the original subject of this thread, that is of North Korea, let us pray for the dear believers there, both in the camps, and “at liberty” in the impoverished towns, villages and communal farms, who dare not sing psalms or hymns, accompanied or unaccompanied, because the neighbours, even their own children, or guards will hear them, denounce them, and they be beaten and tortured or even killed for their faith.
28

News Item5/16/19 7:00 AM
Chris G P | England  Find all comments by Chris G P
Bless you folks. The unaccompanied psalms versus accompanied hymns and psalms controversy is a very strong one, particularly in Reformed circles.

If I visited my old church today from 40 years ago, when I was baptised as a believer, I would be singing unaccompanied psalms only. However that was not the case when I was baptised, as in those days, (under the same pastor!!), we sang traditional hymns, accompanied by an organ in the church on Sundays, or by a piano in the hall for the midweek Bible study and prayer meeting. I even was asked to choose a hymn for my baptism. (“I heard the voice of Jesus say”).

My difficulty with unaccompanied psalms only, is it means I am always looking forward, to Jesus death on the cross to come, not looking back to it being already done, the psalms speak of playing on the harp and psaltery, etc., and most grievously, in those churches, I can never sing the NT name of Jesus in worship, but can only refer to him in veiled OT references.

27

News Item5/15/19 9:11 PM
No one important | Nowhere important  Find all comments by No one important
If you don’t agree with me that is fine. I respect your position. And if I go to a church that only sings hymns I’m certainly not going to get into an argument with him over it. If you want to understand how I feel about it please read Romans 14. I think it applies. Thanks for taking the time to read this.
26

News Item5/15/19 9:11 PM
No one important | Nowhere important  Find all comments by No one important
If you don’t agree with me that is fine. I respect your position. And if I go to a church that only sings hymns I’m certainly not going to get into an argument with him over it. If you want to understand how I feel about it please read Romans 14. I think it applies. Thanks for taking the time to read this.
25

News Item5/15/19 9:05 PM
No one important | Nowhere important  Find all comments by No one important
I do not place manmade hymns on level with God’s psalms. But both can be used to worship God. A position I’m sure that John and Adriel will understand as they also, while not equating it with Scripture, use other sources beside the Bible for study. For example the site where they got the UNinspired hymns article. See? There is no problem here. Both can be used to worship God.
24

News Item5/15/19 8:56 PM
No one important | Nowhere important  Find all comments by No one important
Hi guys, can I just butt in here?
I believe the Bible is the only authority on how to live life and how to please God.
And while I believe that the Bible was written by inspiration of God, And is therefore infallible in 100% true, I believe that many things in the Bible are written, which God did not inspire the speaker to say at the time. For example there is the story of the lying prophet in 1Kings 13:18. What the prophet said was untrue therefore it can not have been inspired by God, correct?
Having established that not all things said in Scripture were inspired by God, (although all were recorded by his inspiration)were the songs of Moses inspired by God? Or how about the song of Deborah and Barak. These are instances where God used sinful men to bring him glory. And he wasn’t upset by it either. In fact later on in scripture he reminds them of the times when they used to sing of him and wants them to do so again.
23

News Item5/15/19 6:51 PM
Dr. Tim | Land of Cotton  Find all comments by Dr. Tim
Well, let us not be dissuaded by mere facts when we have our opinions. My last post on this subject will remain my last until someone can prove me wrong—which so far no one has done or even tried to do. It’s hard to deny truth even when our pet traditions contradict it, isn’t it?
22

News Item5/15/19 3:48 PM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
Adriel wrote:
Bible versus UNinspired hymns??
"Uninspired songs cannot be placed on a level with the songs of inspiration as the rule for “teaching and admonishing.”
All agree that the “Psalms” of the text (Col 3:16) are the inspired Psalms, the very word of God. “Teaching” refers to doctrine, what we are to believe. “Admonishing” refers to practice, how we are to live. It is not conceivable that Paul would place the writings of uninspired men on a level with the Psalms of the Bible as a standard of doctrine and practice. “The scriptures of the Old and New Testaments are the word of God, the only rule of faith and manners.”
...
Excellent point Adriel. I must remember that most relevant point.
21

News Item5/15/19 3:36 PM
Adriel  Find all comments by Adriel
Bible versus UNinspired hymns??

"Uninspired songs cannot be placed on a level with the songs of inspiration as the rule for “teaching and admonishing.”
All agree that the “Psalms” of the text (Col 3:16) are the inspired Psalms, the very word of God. “Teaching” refers to doctrine, what we are to believe. “Admonishing” refers to practice, how we are to live. It is not conceivable that Paul would place the writings of uninspired men on a level with the Psalms of the Bible as a standard of doctrine and practice. “The scriptures of the Old and New Testaments are the word of God, the only rule of faith and manners.”

Uninspired hymns abound in errors. Dr. Cook of Belfast, says, “ I never yet found a compilation of hymns that I could pronounce free from serious errors. In 1838 the Presbyterian General assembly, appointed a committee to revise their hymnbook. In their report they say, “On a critical examination we found many hymns deficient in literary merit, some incorrect in doctrine, and many altogether unsuitable for the sanctuary.” What an indictment to bring against the book which their own church had substituted for God’s book of praises."
www.fpchurch.org.uk/about-us/how-we-worship/exclusive-psalmody/why-psalms-only/

20

News Item5/15/19 10:34 AM
Adriel  Find all comments by Adriel
Dr. Tim wrote:
You overlooked one, Adriel: “Let the words of my mouth [not thy mouth, but my mouth] and the meditation of my heart [not thy heart, but my heart], be acceptable in thy sight, O LORD, my strength, and my redeemer” (Psalm 19:14).
Hey Tim;
You've overlooked a word in that phrase too Tim. What did the psalmist mean by using the word "Let" at the beginning of the verse?

Actually The Hebrew at that point is "emer" - Which is translated = "Let the word"
This appears to be a request by the psalmist asking for God's grace in making his words "acceptable" to God.
It doesn't suggest that he is going to use uninspired words, or come to that 'ideas', to challenge God in some kind of verbal disagreement.
In that he is making the request to God directly he seems to be asking for grace to get it right.

The previous verse is ...
13 Keep back thy servant also from presumptuous sins; let them not have dominion over me: then shall I be upright, and I shall be innocent from the great transgression."

Which seems to be the same theme of requesting God's help to be a better person in the service of God.

__________

As for Psalms versus UNInspired hymns =
You are still stuck with the same problem of = God's version - or Mans???

19

News Item5/15/19 9:49 AM
MS  Find all comments by MS
TMC 👍

Some who post on here are quite sure they were called to be the SA forum magisterium and to give out their opinion on what God says in His Word.
Perhaps meditating on James 3:1 would be more beneficial.

18

News Item5/15/19 9:20 AM
Buckeyes | USA  Find all comments by Buckeyes
(TMC)

About the RP and “Psalms, Hymns, and Odes Spiritual”-

Just my opinion, but it seems inconsistent to hold to the RP (Worship must be based only on the Word of God) and then redefine a portion of the Word of God from “Psalms, Hymns, and Odes Spiritual” to “Only Psalms” based only on the word of fallible historians.

I just never feel comfortable when someone claims that exta-biblical knowledge is the only way to know and avoid some sin. It seems to call into question the way God wrote it, and feels rather close to the Catholic arguement that the Scriptures are too complex for all believers to be able to take at face value.

17

News Item5/15/19 8:56 AM
Dr. Tim | Land of Cotton  Find all comments by Dr. Tim
The Bible records that songs of praise unto God were composed and sung both before and after the Psalms were written, and no one was consumed with fire for doing so. If you want to get technical about it, singing and worshipping are two different things, and very rarely are both ever done at the same time in the Bible. When singing and worshipping take place simultaneously in the Bible, one group worships while a specifically designated group sings. True worship entails at the very least bowing the head before God, and it is not unusual or inappropriate for one to fall on his face before that great King. THAT, and not singing, is true worship.
If we are going to use the Old Testament as our template for worship, then we must hire some Levites to do our singing for us. No one else is authorized to sing in a congregational setting.
16

News Item5/15/19 8:09 AM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
Hi Christopher,

I know the difficulty, because I have found it difficult myself to break away from that which is purely traditional.

You will notice on the forum that most posters hold to the RP, some even without realising it. They will argue, for example that the church is to have a pastor, deacons and elders, and they say there is biblical warrant. This is none other than applying the RP.

In the following passage, two sons were seeking to worship God, but not in a way commanded by God. They imagined they were worshipping God, but instead they were angering God so much that he killed them both.

Leviticus 10:1-3 KJV
(1)  And Nadab and Abihu, the sons of Aaron, took either of them his censer, and put fire therein, and put incense thereon, and offered strange fire before the LORD, which he commanded them not.
(2)  And there went out fire from the LORD, and devoured them, and they died before the LORD.
(3)  Then Moses said unto Aaron, This is it that the LORD spake, saying, I will be sanctified in them that come nigh me, and before all the people I will be glorified. And Aaron held his peace.

God thusly showed us how seriously he takes this whole business of how we are to worship him.

15

News Item5/15/19 7:38 AM
Christopher000 | Rhode Island  Find all comments by Christopher000
Thanks John. I've heard the term, regulative principal", but need to look it up. I won't put you on the spot, but am going to assume that you consider the singing of any manmade hymns, as disobediance; sin, and grieving The Holy Spirit.

I think the church is in a gross state of disrepair, I think there is an enormous amount of compromise going on, and I think few are serious about the strict obediance to every jot and tittle in scripture. I think in our zeal though, we can also dig a bit too deep as we look under each rock to make sure that we're not overlooking anything, and turn some things that aren't all that clear, into clear commands, as just in case, better to play it safe, scenarios.

I'm not saying that you're wrong on the topic...I'm saying that I don't really know just yet, and am still viewing it as a matter of personal preference. I just can't imagine myself walking around the house, and singing, "How Great Thou Art", etc., and it greiving The Holy Spirit, as I sin by song. I'm having trouble processing that.

14

News Item5/15/19 6:48 AM
John UK | Wales  Find all comments by John UK
Good morning Christopher. Here is a statement:

"The light of nature shows that there is a God, who has lordship and sovereignty over all; is just, good and does good to all; and is therefore to be feared, loved, praised, called upon, trusted in, and served, with all the heart and all the soul, and with all the might. But the acceptable way of worshipping the true God, is instituted by himself, and so limited by his own revealed will, that he may not be worshipped according to the imagination and devices of men, nor the suggestions of Satan, under any visible representations, or any other way not prescribed in the Holy Scriptures."

It means you need biblical warrant for the way you worship God.

Another:

"Religious worship is to be given to God the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, and to him alone; not to angels, saints, or any other creatures; and since the fall, not without a mediator, nor in the mediation of any other but Christ alone."

This says that according to the Bible, you may not worship angels, saints or other creature, and your true worship of the Triune God must be through the unique mediator who is Jesus Christ.

This principle is called "Regulative Principle". And it is to be applied to literally everything.

13

News Item5/15/19 6:21 AM
Christopher000 | Rhode Island  Find all comments by Christopher000
Good morning John,

My dad's favorite hymn was, Amazing Grace, and one of mine is, How Great Thou Art. Was he, and am I, in sin when singing either? Whether or not I'm grieving The Holy Spirit, and in sin while doing so is all that matters to me. I'm not sure if your bottomline is that it qualifies as sin, or if it's more of a preference, over a command, etc.

12
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