â In a fallen world where obviously only a Remnant have faith - Why is it so hard to see that said faith is clearly a gift from God to HIS Elect?â
The reason it is hard to see is because it isnât Biblical. Like I pointed out, even if it were saying that faith is a gift, it wouldnât mean people had to believe. It doesnât demonstrate that Irresistible Grace is taught in scripture!
The elect according to salvation are always those who believed. Those who donât believe, but will later, are not part of the elect yet. They will be selected for eternal life when they believe and not before that.
Not that any of you are right, because you are not, but even if it said faith was a gift, a gift can be received or rejected. It doesnât prove God overforces people to believe against their will. Sorry!
Whenever someone from the Calvinist camp says something so blatantly false, Iâm surprised that nobody speaks up! Nobody thinks they can save themselves? Do you know anything about the Pharisees?!
At any rate, the past tense act of Gentiles being saved is the topic of the sentence. Paul is getting the Gentiles to look back at the moment they were saved by Godâs grace and saved through faith as an example of how they are now partakers of the gospel and of the salvation it brings.
âThat the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of His promise in Christ by the gospel:â ââEphesiansâŹ â3:6âŹ
âIn whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that Holy Spirit of promise,â ââEphesiansâŹ â1:13âŹ
Are you saying my reasoning is blasphemous because I donât believe the Bible teaches that Jesus suffered the punishment for each and every particular sin? It doesnât teach anywhere that Jesus did. Nowhere is the concept taught that Jesus suffered eternal damnation for the sins of anyone. For one, He would still be in Hell and secondly, Jesus wouldnât have arose from the grave three days later. What the Bible does teach is Jesus suffered death for us. Not that we donât also suffer it, but He did it as someone who didnât deserve to die because He was sinless. So Jesus took on the responsibility to do away with our sins by dying on the cross. However, that doesnât mean He suffered a penalty over here for this person and then a separate sentence for someone over there. In fact, the Bible never teaches that Jesus suffered in Hell. It is all unfounded speculation!
I know you will never admit to it, but I need to let you know.
âFor by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.â ââEphesiansâŹ â2:8-9âŹ
The verse in question shows that salvation is by grace and that salvation is through faith. With both faith and grace tied to salvation, wouldnât you think that salvation is the topic of the sentence? So when it says, âit is the gift of Godâ, one should look to the topic to see what it is. Furthermore, there is biblical examples elsewhere to back up the idea that salvation is what God gives believers and that salvation cannot be earned. You have the verse basically saying to believers that He gave them faith after they already believed. Think about who God is talking to here. Also look to the fact that faith is never spoken of as a work that people shouldnât boast about. In fact, it is impossible to boast about faith. There is no boasting in believing that you cannot save yourself and need Jesus to save you!
In John 3:16, whosoever means anyone who wants to believe can. It up to each person.
If Jesus paid the penalty for sins, then He was culpable. He took the blame for them and was punished, supposedly. The Bible doesnât teach that story. If Jesus took on punishment for sins He did not commit He would still be in the grave and suffering for those sins. Having someone pay for your crimes doesnât make you innocent of committing those crimes. It would literally accomplish nothing for Jesus to pay off your sins. You would still die and be separated from Godâs presence. Maybe without the punishment, but still with all of the guilt.
Eph 2:8 Is talking about salvation. That is the point of the sentence! Itâs by grace you are saved and salvation is through faith. Thatâs what it is. However, for the sake of argument letâs say faith is a gift. It doesnât say it is given to people who were arbitrarily picked to be saved before they were born. So my point still stands. Also, if your doctrine about something comes from only one verse, be careful because it is probably not true. God speaks plainly about what He has revealed, so that we may know and not guess.
Jesus said all that the Father gives me will come to me. It is future tense. Meaning, in the future all believers will come to him. Meaning they will go where He is. He says, I have come down from Heaven and will return. That means we will meet Him in Heaven one day. For some reason Calvinist equate âcomeâ which means to move toward, with the word believe. Not sure why in the context.
Funny thing about John 12:19, the phrase is hyperbole and yet it still means the whole world as it says.
Propitiation: The act of reconciliation through atonement. Jesus reconciled the world through His atoning sacrifice on the cross.
Jesus paid for the sins of the whole world, but He was not culpable for the sins of RC, JW, etc.
God provides the means of faith through the preaching of His word so that all who hear it may believe.
The reason you have to state that faith is the gift of God to the elect is because the Bible doesnât teach that anywhere. You shouldnât add to scripture! The elect are generally the nation of Israel or those who believe. So that if there is a person who does not believe, they are not elect, but if they should believe, they will become part of that group selected by God for eternal life.
When God wants to differentiate between Jews and Gentiles, He says so plainly. This is just a sad attempt to disregard what God said! God, in His sovereignty, had it translated the way we would best understand it, so not only does it mean the whole world, it says the whole world. Jesus is the propitiation for our sins. By that time, Jews and Gentiles both became believers, so âoursâ would mean both. Not for Jew and Gentile only, but also for the sins of the whole world. After all, isnât that why God sent His Son? That whosoever believes in Him will have eternal life. Not to mention we are all one in Christ, there is neither Jew or Gentile.
âAnd, behold, a certain lawyer stood up, and tempted him, saying, Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life? He said unto him, What is written in the law? how readest thou? And he answering said, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbour as thyself. And he said unto him, Thou hast answered right: this do, and thou shalt live.â ââLukeâŹ â10:25-28âŹ
When Jesus was asked, He said you must love the Lord your God. People will receive eternal life because they believed in Jesus and God showed them mercy.
Jesus died for His sheep, but that doesnât erase the fact that He is the atoning sacrifice for the whole world.
âAnd he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.â ââ1 JohnâŹ â2:2âŹ
If Jesus was culpable for the sins of the whole world, we would know it because He would have remained in the grave and we would all remain condemned. Thereâs no mystery to that fact! Furthermore, having someone else suffer the consequences of your sins doesnât make you innocent of committing those sins.
Jesus did bare the sins of many in His flesh, which doesnât exclude any who will believe, but not all people will believe. Therefore, His death only bares the sins of those who believe and not those who donât.
As the man said, âthis cannot mean that Christ so took upon Himself the sins of the people as to become Himself a sinnerâ and âThey (sins) cannot be literally transferred to anotherâ. What happened is Jesus bared the consequence of our sins, but not the culpability for them. The consequence being, suffering death when He had no business dying.
Jesus did suffer for our sins. He was beaten and died for our sins, because of our sins. He just wasnât culpable or guilty for each and every sin which people have ever committed. Jesus would still be in the grave if that were the case. For one, just for my sins alone, He would have to be punished eternally and would still be dead until my sins were paid for. Yet, Jesus hasnât suffered the consequences for my sins, or anyone elseâs, by the fact of His resurrection. Two, if He weâre guilty of individual sins, He would have been an imperfect sacrifice and unworthy of being resurrected.
So what did the cross accomplish? Jesus having satisfied the requirements of the law and being unjustly put to death, being innocent from the guilt of sin by God (the Father), was raised to life in a new resurrected body.
So what did that accomplish? When Jesus ascended to Heaven, God the Father gave the Holy Spirit to all who believe. Now those who are in Christ are no longer guilty of sin because of the righteousness of Christ.
âTherefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.â ââRomansâŹ â6:4âŹ
âAnd hath raised us up together, and made us sit together
âAnd as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life. For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved.â ââJohnâŹ â3:14-17âŹ
If I were asked, I would say God lobes the world because that is what Jesus said.