Those Jews were plainly told who Jesus was before and would not believe. The sheep were all of those who believed in God previously and had not yet been brought into the fold of Jesus Christ. Those who believed in God, heard the voice of Jesus and believed in Him. They were of His fold and the others who had not yet heard had to be brought in. They were His lost sheep.
To say why one person is saved and another isnâ€™t, is not revealed in Scripture other than one believed and the other didnâ€™t. God will sort that out.
There isnâ€™t a whole lot revealed about individual punishment per sin in the Bible. We know of the eternal separation from God and that there are worse punishments. So if you believe Jesus was punished for each individual sin, where would you start? Does that mean He entered Hell or that He was in the very pits of it? Jesus was raised, so we know He didnâ€™t suffer eternal separation from God or even went to Hell, so how did He supposedly suffer the penalty of everyoneâ€™s particular sins so as to pay off God? You canâ€™t just make up that He did! The Bible, which I follow and believe in, says that Jesus died for our sins and because of our sins. It says nothing to particular punishment that He paid which would have then made anyone guiltless of being a sinner. Like I have said, a lot of stuff is taught by Calvinist, but when you dig into it, you find there is nothing there. No irresistible grace or desire by God to only save a arbitrary few. God says He loves the world and Jesus is the propitiation for the sins of the whole world for whosoever will believe in Him. Who am I to argue with how He has sovereignty decided it to be?
I answered why some choose to believe and others donâ€™t. What some people want to know is why specific people believe and others donâ€™t. The Bible doesnâ€™t give a case for each individual person.
â€śNow when Jesus heard these things, he said unto him, Yet lackest thou one thing: sell all that thou hast, and distribute unto the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, follow me. And when he heard this, he was very sorrowful: for he was very rich. And when Jesus saw that he was very sorrowful, he said, How hardly shall they that have riches enter into the kingdom of God!â€ť â€â€Lukeâ€¬ â€18:22-24â€¬
In this case the man didnâ€™t want to give up any riches that he had. Itâ€™s different for different people.
Also, I said â€śare yeâ€ť was current tense which means that the Gentileâ€™s salvation is what should be considered the gift of God because the act of grace shown them and their own faith are past tense, while the gift was yet to be received. They had not yet entered into eternal life.
The reason all donâ€™t believe is because not all are willing to hear the truth so as to believe, not all are willing to confess their sins before God, not all want to follow Him because they love darkness rather than light. The reason people believe is because once confronted with the truth, they donâ€™t choose to ignore it or disregard it, they hear of how God so loved the world and sent His Son to die for the forgiveness of their sins that they reciprocate that love in repentance and faith. Maybe it is that they are more honest about the truth and grateful for what Jesus has done for them. That is less a reflection on how good they are because they are still sinners in need of the Savior, but it is a reflection of how wicked those are who will not obey the call of the gospel!
The way God changes minds is through the gospel message.
â€śHow then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?â€ť â€â€Romansâ€¬ â€10:14â€¬
It certainly isnâ€™t through Calvinist dogma that people believe! It isnâ€™t even scriptural. They think if they repeat the same words that are found in the Bible, they can pour into them any sort of meaning they want.
â€śBut if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost: In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.â€ť â€â€2 Corinthiansâ€¬ â€4:3-4â€¬
The gospel is only hid to those who have previously not believed.
â€śFor nothing is secret, that shall not be made manifest; neither any thing hid, that shall not be known and come abroad. Take heed therefore how ye hear: for whosoever hath, to him shall be given; and whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken even that which he seemeth to have.â€ť â€â€Lukeâ€¬ â€8:17-18â€¬
The gospel is made known to all so they are without excuse and from there it may be taken away if they will not believe. Nobody will be fashioned into a believer who doesnâ€™t want to be.
I keep hearing that salvation isnâ€™t even in the verse, then what does the word â€śsavedâ€ť mean? The Gentile believers received salvation by grace, through faith! That salvation they received was not because of anything they did to earn it, it is the gift of God.
Grace was what they were shown and faith is what they had in order to be saved, those things were in the past for them. However, the gift of God is what was happening right now. Whatever you think â€śitâ€ť is must be something that was still considered the gift of God. Grace was already shown and faith was already something they had in order to be saved. The only thing current tense would be their salvation, which was still their gift from God.
â€śFor the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.â€ť â€â€Romansâ€¬ â€6:23â€¬
â€ś In a fallen world where obviously only a Remnant have faith - Why is it so hard to see that said faith is clearly a gift from God to HIS Elect?â€ť
The reason it is hard to see is because it isnâ€™t Biblical. Like I pointed out, even if it were saying that faith is a gift, it wouldnâ€™t mean people had to believe. It doesnâ€™t demonstrate that Irresistible Grace is taught in scripture!
The elect according to salvation are always those who believed. Those who donâ€™t believe, but will later, are not part of the elect yet. They will be selected for eternal life when they believe and not before that.
Not that any of you are right, because you are not, but even if it said faith was a gift, a gift can be received or rejected. It doesnâ€™t prove God overforces people to believe against their will. Sorry!
Whenever someone from the Calvinist camp says something so blatantly false, Iâ€™m surprised that nobody speaks up! Nobody thinks they can save themselves? Do you know anything about the Pharisees?!
At any rate, the past tense act of Gentiles being saved is the topic of the sentence. Paul is getting the Gentiles to look back at the moment they were saved by Godâ€™s grace and saved through faith as an example of how they are now partakers of the gospel and of the salvation it brings.
â€śThat the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of His promise in Christ by the gospel:â€ť â€â€Ephesiansâ€¬ â€3:6â€¬
â€śIn whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that Holy Spirit of promise,â€ť â€â€Ephesiansâ€¬ â€1:13â€¬
Are you saying my reasoning is blasphemous because I donâ€™t believe the Bible teaches that Jesus suffered the punishment for each and every particular sin? It doesnâ€™t teach anywhere that Jesus did. Nowhere is the concept taught that Jesus suffered eternal damnation for the sins of anyone. For one, He would still be in Hell and secondly, Jesus wouldnâ€™t have arose from the grave three days later. What the Bible does teach is Jesus suffered death for us. Not that we donâ€™t also suffer it, but He did it as someone who didnâ€™t deserve to die because He was sinless. So Jesus took on the responsibility to do away with our sins by dying on the cross. However, that doesnâ€™t mean He suffered a penalty over here for this person and then a separate sentence for someone over there. In fact, the Bible never teaches that Jesus suffered in Hell. It is all unfounded speculation!
I know you will never admit to it, but I need to let you know.
â€śFor by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.â€ť â€â€Ephesiansâ€¬ â€2:8-9â€¬
The verse in question shows that salvation is by grace and that salvation is through faith. With both faith and grace tied to salvation, wouldnâ€™t you think that salvation is the topic of the sentence? So when it says, â€śit is the gift of Godâ€ť, one should look to the topic to see what it is. Furthermore, there is biblical examples elsewhere to back up the idea that salvation is what God gives believers and that salvation cannot be earned. You have the verse basically saying to believers that He gave them faith after they already believed. Think about who God is talking to here. Also look to the fact that faith is never spoken of as a work that people shouldnâ€™t boast about. In fact, it is impossible to boast about faith. There is no boasting in believing that you cannot save yourself and need Jesus to save you!
In John 3:16, whosoever means anyone who wants to believe can. It up to each person.
If Jesus paid the penalty for sins, then He was culpable. He took the blame for them and was punished, supposedly. The Bible doesnâ€™t teach that story. If Jesus took on punishment for sins He did not commit He would still be in the grave and suffering for those sins. Having someone pay for your crimes doesnâ€™t make you innocent of committing those crimes. It would literally accomplish nothing for Jesus to pay off your sins. You would still die and be separated from Godâ€™s presence. Maybe without the punishment, but still with all of the guilt.
Eph 2:8 Is talking about salvation. That is the point of the sentence! Itâ€™s by grace you are saved and salvation is through faith. Thatâ€™s what it is. However, for the sake of argument letâ€™s say faith is a gift. It doesnâ€™t say it is given to people who were arbitrarily picked to be saved before they were born. So my point still stands. Also, if your doctrine about something comes from only one verse, be careful because it is probably not true. God speaks plainly about what He has revealed, so that we may know and not guess.
Jesus said all that the Father gives me will come to me. It is future tense. Meaning, in the future all believers will come to him. Meaning they will go where He is. He says, I have come down from Heaven and will return. That means we will meet Him in Heaven one day. For some reason Calvinist equate â€ścomeâ€ť which means to move toward, with the word believe. Not sure why in the context.
Funny thing about John 12:19, the phrase is hyperbole and yet it still means the whole world as it says.
Propitiation: The act of reconciliation through atonement. Jesus reconciled the world through His atoning sacrifice on the cross.
Jesus paid for the sins of the whole world, but He was not culpable for the sins of RC, JW, etc.
God provides the means of faith through the preaching of His word so that all who hear it may believe.
The reason you have to state that faith is the gift of God to the elect is because the Bible doesnâ€™t teach that anywhere. You shouldnâ€™t add to scripture! The elect are generally the nation of Israel or those who believe. So that if there is a person who does not believe, they are not elect, but if they should believe, they will become part of that group selected by God for eternal life.
When God wants to differentiate between Jews and Gentiles, He says so plainly. This is just a sad attempt to disregard what God said! God, in His sovereignty, had it translated the way we would best understand it, so not only does it mean the whole world, it says the whole world. Jesus is the propitiation for our sins. By that time, Jews and Gentiles both became believers, so â€śoursâ€ť would mean both. Not for Jew and Gentile only, but also for the sins of the whole world. After all, isnâ€™t that why God sent His Son? That whosoever believes in Him will have eternal life. Not to mention we are all one in Christ, there is neither Jew or Gentile.
â€śAnd, behold, a certain lawyer stood up, and tempted him, saying, Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life? He said unto him, What is written in the law? how readest thou? And he answering said, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbour as thyself. And he said unto him, Thou hast answered right: this do, and thou shalt live.â€ť â€â€Lukeâ€¬ â€10:25-28â€¬
When Jesus was asked, He said you must love the Lord your God. People will receive eternal life because they believed in Jesus and God showed them mercy.
Jesus died for His sheep, but that doesnâ€™t erase the fact that He is the atoning sacrifice for the whole world.
â€śAnd he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.â€ť â€â€1 Johnâ€¬ â€2:2â€¬
If Jesus was culpable for the sins of the whole world, we would know it because He would have remained in the grave and we would all remain condemned. Thereâ€™s no mystery to that fact! Furthermore, having someone else suffer the consequences of your sins doesnâ€™t make you innocent of committing those sins.